…my point exactly. Most people don’t and I’d be willing to be that most people on this blog don’t hang out around Angie’s (or anywhere in “downtown” Columbia City) at this time. Those who live close by and can hear it and see it on a regular basis seem to be the ones who are arguing how severe the problem is.

Others , however, are quick to right it off as just another dose of gentrification. My guess is that they don’t live as close enough to the problems for it to directly impact them and their sense of safety.

…and my guess is that you weren’t there between the hours of 11:00-2, or hanging out in the alleys aroundthe bar. Which is when and where most of the problems occur. Sunday nights are also pretty tame no matter what bar you might be at.

Well said. This is not a race issue, it’s a safety issue. I’m not arguing that Angie’s isn’t a South End institution…but, it’s undeniable that the place is dangerous and violence, prostitution, and serious crimes occur there and around the property on a regular basis.

Why people want to be the universal defenders of an establishment that brings these types of threats to our neighborhood is beyond me. For a jukebox? For a pool table? For a sense of the old, pre-”hipster,” pre-yuppie, pre-wine bar, pre-gentrified CC? For an after-work hangout?…I’m sorry, but when it comes down to those defenses and the general well-being and overall safety of Columbia City, those arguments just seem shallow…and like Mich implied above, filled with a healthy dose of anti-white sentiment.

I’d be all for keeping Angie’s if it stepped up, took some serious initiative, worked with the city, and actually listened to the neighborhood–but, unfortunately, they haven’t. Their actions are half-assed reactive measures (like their current “1-more offense and Angie’s might be gone” sign on the front door) and never anything proactive. Sure, they do a nice job sweeping up the sidewalk, but really that’s about it. The bar’s “take it outside, take it to the alley…and don’t get us busted” attitude and long-standing tradition is dangerous and spills over to residential streets. My sincere hope is that the pro-Angie’s lot just simply doesn’t live close enough to the bar to really witness these problems first-hand on a regular basis. But, for those of us whose families are regularly woken up by the fights, gunshots, and sirens coming from Angie’s, we get it. If you do see the problems, and still think there’s a strong case that Angie’s doors should remain open…well, then there’s some real disappointing and disheartening priorities out there.

” @38: I would argue that RAS & Henderson is a much better place 2 score dope, hoes, fights & guns. Significantly lower profile than hipster CC. Wouldn’t you say?”

This! And I’m sick of it! Although has anyone else spotted more bicycle cops around the south side of Rainier Ave near Cloverdale/Henderson? Better yet, these cops seem to be venturing from the main strip and ducking into those side streets and alleyways these crooks like to hang out in. Possibly the results of our suggestion to the mayor?

” Is it me or is there a nasty undercurrent of racism bubbling below the surface on RVP threads like this one?”

There is, although if anything it’s rooted in calling the race card far too often. Do you have to be white to dislike shootings and drug dealing where we should be enjoying our dinner, shopping for groceries, commuting to and from work, or watching our children play? Is it a white thing to dislike a bar that simply shoves crime out the front door and hope it gets sorted out in the alley way? Or are we just racist for wanting to live somewhere in our city that we can afford and make it safe, thereby “invading neighborhoods”. Honestly, I’ve been called [insert derogatory white racial comment] more than I can count since moving here, at times while doing nothing more than walking from the bus stop to my home to deserve such a remark. So yes, there is definitely an issue with “racism” in this area; my guess is on all sides of the fence (not just black vs white here in 98118).

But get this straight: It’s not racist to want to live somewhere safe. It’s not racist to want a business to go elsewhere when they can’t keep crime from spilling out of their parking lot. It -is- racist to imply that these are “white people” problems. It -is- racist to make racial comments or implications even if you -are- a minority. Lastly, calling something “racist” when inappropriate just tells me you have nothing valuable to add to the conversation; is that really where you want to stand in matters that are important to you?

I personally would love to keep the local character, although if that involves keeping the crime that comes with it than good riddance! Replace it with a business that will not only respect the neighborhood’s culture and history but also the safety of those that share the community.

Here’s a test: Pick out the one sentence in your comment that was unacceptable.

If you can’t, then you probably don’t need RVP commenting rights.